Ep#18 – Fermentation: Life in the Kitchen with Chef Cynthia Louise

These past weeks we have been exploring life inside the soil and our guts. The beautiful microbes that are imperative to the health of both areas, in fact many areas of life! 

Today we dive into the journey of life and death cycles and how the microbes pay an epic role in creating delicious fermentation’s that not just make your food more digestible, but help you to build the biodiversity inside your gut.

The amazing Chef Cynthia Louise doesn’t just stop at the level of food, we go into how our mind and the thoughts play such an important role as well.

Come sit at the kitchen table with us and enjoy the conversation….

Chef Cynthia’s Light and Easy Course with Fermentation’s and much much more: https://cooking.chefcynthialouise.com/lets-eat-light-and-easy

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Episode 18: Fermentation: Life in the Kitchen with Chef Cynthia Louise 

Welcome to Thriving with Nature, a podcast that gives you the tools you need to live a modern lifestyle that helps regenerate our planet. And now your host, Hayley Weatherburn.

Hayley: Welcome Thrivers to another episode of Thriving with Nature. I am Hayley Weatherburn and we are so honored to have Chef Cynthia Louise back inside her kitchen. Thank you, chef for having us. 

Chef Cynthia: Thank you for having me. 

Hayley: For those of you who haven’t been introduced to Chef Cynthia Louise episode four of the podcast of Thriving with Nature, you get to hear her amazing journey into how she’s become one of the world’s renowned chefs on the planet when it comes to whole foods and nourishing your organs. Today, what we’re going to do is talk about how to build a healthy gut microbiome and why that’s so important. So, Chef Cynthia, tell me about your journey of why the gut microbiome is important.

Chef Cynthia: Well, it’s so interesting because it takes me back to growing soil. Like when I was in my 20s, I’m 50 in a few months, I decided to get right into gardening. It was really strange. I was building this, I had this property and I was building. I was landscaping. I wasn’t thinking about food as such, but I needed soil and I would get soil shipped in like boarding by the truckload and mulch, sugar cane. And it kind of started there and I started to look at the different quality sources that were coming in from different trucks, from different suppliers because I was trying to get the cheapest thing I possibly had. I think it was on the Dole that actually, I’m pretty sure, I can’t remember. It’s true. I had a child and I wasn’t working, but I was getting some sort of whatever. But I remember and I’m glad you asked this question because I looked at the question yesterday and I was like, Oh, that’s right. I remember different trucks delivering different soil from different suppliers in the landscaping business. And I remember feeling to myself, wow, that wasn’t as good as that one. That one is quite dry. This one’s really moist and quite smelly. This one has a lot of bacteria and is starting to smell quite composting and quite shocking. And then, some have lots of living creatures in there. And I noticed my chickens automatically went to the soil with the living creature in there. And then, what I mean by living creatures is all the soil had living creatures in it. But one particular brand company delivery was more prominent. And I was just like, wow. If you’d look in the soil and if you pick it up and you stare at it for a minute, you might see something move. It’s not a worm. I’m not talking about a worm or a little animal. I’m talking about (what) you might see the soil just shift like this. You know what I mean? And I think, Oh, what’s that? What’s that? And so from there, I thought I’m going to get that soil. And that was actually probably the most expensive soil in the whole thing. And I remember thinking to myself, I’m going to grow it myself. I’m going to grow my own soil. And then, I started playing with compost and then I started to understand the microbes in the soil and how important it was. And I got right into it by also using later understanding that the water had just from the tap watering my garden for the fluoride and chemicals and whatever was killing those microbes. So, it was really important. I remember using newspaper at one point to grow soil, like covering on food scraps, then living seaweed and then dead branches and then do use paper and then just making these layers. And I just remember, Oh, the newspaper that will kill the microbes because of the ink in the newspaper. So, I started getting right through it. And then, I understood how my plants felt when I was planting in that soil and how the difference was. And I could just see little differences, but those little differences to me were a lot. There was a lot more growth in a short amount of time compared to the other plants. Was it the sun? Was it without an app? Are they getting enough water? Was the water seeping away because my land is like this. And I thought, no, it’s the microbes in the soil. And I think that’s where I started to understand that the deep benefits of living when we think soil is dead. 

Hayley: Yeah. Exactly. From that, how did you connect (with it)? Did you notice the differences in the plants, too? Did you notice the difference in the flavor of the food and/or did you notice the difference about what you were eating? Did you see that connection go further, deeper into how you felt when you were? 

Chef Cynthia: I didn’t notice a difference and the flavor of the food when I grew my own food. I didn’t notice a difference in soil. It wasn’t until I started becoming interested in biodynamic farming that I noticed the difference in flavor. [Awesome.] It was in my own situation and I was right into permaculture. And I had this amazing two-acre property and I segregated it off and I’ll be rotating crops and animals and things. I didn’t notice it then, but it wasn’t until I got right into that area of farming later on that I was like, there is such a profound difference in biodynamic produce, whether it’s animal flesh or it’s milk or it’s fruit and vegetables to organic. And I was like, what? And that’s when I started to really invest in Steiner’s teachings and to really understand the 500 method and it goes to my phone in 501, 502 and it goes and goes and goes. And it even goes right down to the appreciation of the top of the soil, in between of the soil, the base of the roots of the plants and beyond and beyond and beyond, beyond as is the encompassing energy of the moon cycle. So, it was this whole thing. And I just remember, even when you’re doing one of the systems where you’ve got to swell a certain way or a certain moon day, I remember thinking to myself, that’s what’s happening here. We’re actually growing a child-like substance of soil. And because once you know when you’re pregnant? 

Hayley: Not yet. One day.

Chef Cynthia: When you’re pregnant, you’d come to this realization. It’s like I must eat. I must not drink alcohol. I must not smoke cigarettes. I must feed for two. And the soil started to, I started to really recognize that was a baby and I needed to feed for two. And that was that process and it was only splitting. It wasn’t like I sat there for months and was like, Oh, well it was just splitting things and then I just appreciated funny methods in the soil. 

Hayley: It’s amazing. It’s something I recently heard in regards to that is out of the flavor is our senses’ way of showing what has higher nutrients. What’s more beneficial for us? The ones that have that nature, I mean, I think we’ve all experienced back in the day if you’re in a garden. I had a neighbor that had a tomato and we as kids would pull it off and eat it like an apple. You can’t do that with a tomato in a lot of supermarkets these days. What you’d be like, why would you do that? [Yeah.] That’s weed. It doesn’t have much flavor. But these tomatoes had so much flavor and so many more nutrients. And as we actually shared in episode four about how some carrots, the way it’s grown has more nutrition than like the commercial monocrop kind of carrots. 

Chef Cynthia: So, nutrition equals flavor, flavor equals nutrition. [Yes, exactly.] Without you dissecting it, it is just nature gets it right every time. It’s so true. Like without even so true because a lot of (it) in the wellness industry, we dissect things to nutritional parts and that’s great and everything and we all know human minds to do that. But really at the end of the day when the soil is treated like a living child, like a baby growing, as we breed a baby in our tummies, we are doing the same thing to soil. We’re breeding soil in such a way. And that like the flavor is mind-blowing and you wouldn’t want to dissect the nutritional parts. What it is, it is there, right? 

Hayley: Exactly. And so, connecting that Anastasia, the books that I like to talk about and read. It talks about when you forget everything we’ve taught, almost everything we’ve learned and you go back to like if you were a child. And let’s imagine that fruit, vegetables have all their original amazing flavors, like a cucumber doesn’t just taste like water. It has so much flavor in it. Our bodies, we don’t need to know vitamin K, vitamin C, our bodies would go, ah, I’m feeling like a cucumber. And that’s the internal, where’s my nutrition? Like you don’t need to understand it. It’s just your body that will do that. So, talking about microbiomes, talking about the microbes in the soil and then, the microbes coming into the gut,  because you have a love of fermentation. I’m going to have to share this, this ginger beer ferment. Would you call it a ginger beer? 

Chef Cynthia: Yes, it is a ginger beer. It has alcohol in it. Because all those ferments have alcohol in them. 

Hayley: It’s ferments. So, there’s creatures here. There’s microbes in here and it is so nourishing. As a chef, you love the cooking. What attracted you to ferments and was it in anything in regards to your microbiome, into nourishing your organs or how did the connection of ferments come in?

Chef Cynthia: It was never about health. It was always about engaging. It was all about engaging in the process of taking something and watching it breaking down. [Fascinating.] And I find that [the lifecycle of nature] extraordinary fascinating for me. So you can look at it like compost, right? Compost is the same. I find compost extraordinary fascinating, especially when looked after and it’s a pleasure. It’s a pleasure to grow soil through compost. But fermentation for me was never about getting microbes into me or health. I was just so intrigued that I’m salivating thinking about it. So intrigued how I could take something like a daikon. Daikon is a really long roundish. It has a wonderful long situation here. It goes into the ground. It sprouts out. It creates the right nitrogen for soil. And I can’t stand them. I can’t stand eating them. They’re gross. But if I ferment it, Oh my God, [wow]. It is completely the opposite of what it was in the beginning and it’s been breaking down and breaking down and fermenting for me to watch that become a life. Then, we’ve picked it and it’s slowly breaking down. But we’re helping it ferment by having the right environment, by having the right headspace, by having the right tools, by having the right ingredients, by having the right systems of fermentation, which could mean a dry salty brine or wet salty brine. It could be a culture from another ferment. It could be simply its own sugars eating up through the yeast in the air. And so for me, it was like purely just interest. 

Hayley: It’s like nature’s chemistry. 

Chef Cynthia: It’s totally like when you throw an apple on the compost bin, in the bush, like I always chuck my stuff. If I’m eating something, I’ll just throw it on the ground because I know it’s going to break down. And I’ve always been like that. And people are like, don’t litter. I don’t. I’m like, it’s banana skin. It belongs back into the earth. Fermentation is like it. It’s so inquisitive. It’s such an inquisitive thing in it and there’s so much life becoming there like good bacteria grows and bad bacteria on a ferment comes along and kills it and it contaminates, then good grows again. That’s the life of fermentation. And I just find it fascinating. I just honestly find it fascinating that when I do health wise. 

Hayley: Yeah, that’s what it is. It is the life cycle. I think the more you look into nature and just watch it, just observing it.  Something that Dr. Josh Axe, a book I’m reading called “Eat dirt”. He talks about the balance of our microbes in the gut is about 85% good to 15% bad. Would you say or can you kind of see how that actually is similar in the ferments that you need? There’s a bit of a balance of (it). It needs a bit of both to create the bubbliness of the life that’s inside it, right? 

Chef Cynthia: Yeah. We need good and bad bacteria to have a greater immune system to be able to have the ability to fight bad bacteria. So, ferments, (it’s) interesting. I don’t sterilize jars. I wash them out and make sure they’re dry completely by air drying, not by cloth. And I don’t wash or I take the dirt out of my fingernails and ferment. And I use wood which carries so much bacteria, right? And these are the no-no’s of food safety and hygiene fermentation now. Way back then when our parents and grandparents and their parents and their parents fermented, they would use the same wooden barrel and that would take the cows milk and they would churn it into butter and they would churn that butter in that same wooden barrel and they would never wash it. And if you take a microscope and look at the size of that barrel, you see the life of the good bacteria and the bad bacteria coming along to contaminate and kill it and make it go off. And then, it grows good bacteria. Now, you take steel and do that. You can’t. It’s not possible. The bad bacteria keeps growing and then the good bacteria dies and it tries to come back in the bad and you got to catch it at a certain time. But it’s good bacteria. And so, I just find myself with fermentation no rules and I stuff it up all the time and it’s all energy. I swear to God, it’s all energy and it’s a really beautiful place to dance in and it’s just so fascinating. I’m so fascinated by it. Actually, I can’t believe I am so fascinated by the moment I’m making apple cider vinegar. It’s going to take three months, right? [Yeah.] But, I’m just fascinated by the rottenness of the color change, you know?

Hayley: Yeah. We were just in the ferment section and these apples, I said, well, those apples are red because there’s red spots on the back of the chopped apples. And I’m like, is it like a red spotted apple? I’ve never seen it, but it’s the color (that) is slowly breaking down. 

Chef Cynthia: But it’s actually not death. Everything is just eating and it’s like the yeast in the air is hitting the sugar and the apples and the liquid sugar solution that I created and it’s just breaking down and it’s going to turn into something magnificent. And it’s kind of like my son Jaman said to me this once, and this is really interesting. He said, when I die, mom, I want to ferment into the soil. [Wow]. I don’t want to be cremated. He said because I come from life. So therefore, I’m going to give that back into life, which is soil. And I was like, that’s so cool. That’s so cool. I love that because that’s what it is. It’s not breaking down and dying. That’s actually creating something extraordinary.

Hayley: I want to feed the world, feed life. That reminds me of the Avatar that shows that there’s that sort of montage with the person’s dying. If life goes in, its life begets life. It’s just energy transfer. [Exactly]. Absolutely. So, you mentioned just before about the immune system. Right now in the world, everyone’s freaking out about the immune systems. And I’ve recently, in the last couple of episodes, if you’ve been following, I’ve been talking more about the microbes. And the fact in Eat Dirt in my last episode, Dr. Josh Axe talks about the microbiome is the army or the guard dogs of the immune system. It’s all one of the same thing. In the immune system and gut microbes, what do you know about that? What would you like to talk about in regards to that? We’re talking about ferments. We’re talking about how they can help us. They’ve got microbes. They help create biodiversity. I’m finding that the more we create a bio-diverse microbiome in our gut, the more healthy we have, the more we’re building our immune system. Something you’ve just mentioned about how, going back to the wooden (barrels) where there’s diversity here, we’re not sterilizing everything. You’re giving yourself the opportunity to be in front of all the different microbes to be, in contact with many different microbes. So, tell us what are some of the basic ferments that people could start with that would start to introduce some different microbes into their world? What’s a starting point for someone who goes, okay, I want to start doing some kind of permits?

Chef Cynthia: I think probably the easiest way is a wet ferment. I find that as for a startup person. So, a dry ferment is like a salty brine. So you take an animal, a pig for instance, and you cut its leg off and it’s thigh and you rub salt all over it and you press it there for so many days and you hang it up and dry it and that salt protects that and starts breaking things down. That’s got a dry ferment. And then, you can do that with vegetables and whatnot. And then you can have a wet ferment. The wet ferment is the easiest way to do it. Because the dry ferment, you’ve got to watch it and you’ve got to make sure you get things submerged under the liquid of that salt bringing in it. You want to push that down. Now, wet ferment is water and salt. And so if I got a jar and cut up, say that daikon radish that I talked about before, and slice it up nice and thin and I put it into a salty solution just like the seawater, same kind of saltiness. And then, I’ll let it sit on the bench for a few hours and I might add a chili in there, just throw a chili in there. Then, I might bless it and I might put it in a jar and then push the little bits down and think just kind of sitting on them, pushing the daikon down. And then, I’ll close the lid and put it on my bench. That is the best way to start because you don’t have to keep pushing it down because it already has the liquid in there. Because a dry ferment on that daikon if I rubbed it and rubbed it to try and get the moisture out, then I’m going to get a little bit of moisture and the daikon telling me then I’m going to have to push it down every day. But a wet ferment like this particular thing that I’m talking about is already submerged in water. So, any kind of cauliflower or radishes in a jar with water-salt solution, then you can add your seeds for flavor like Juniper berries or Bay leaves or cumin seeds or fennel seeds or something like that. And then, the next one is your vessel. What’s your vessel? And the easiest way is to go online and get those little lids and they’ve got a little air plug in there, which you feel the water so that you don’t have to touch anything. And you allow the process to break down. And as it’s breaking down, you’ll start to see bubbles form. Once you see those bubbles form, you know that sugar has been eaten up. You know that something’s happening. And the more bubbles that form, the greater the position the fermenting healthy lives, not for us health wise, it’s always in there. It’s always the health of the ferment. And so that’s what I recommend, a wet solution.

Hayley: Yeah. Like sauerkraut, like that’s probably the first one. 

Chef Cynthia: That’s a dry ferment. 

Hayley: Oh really? So sauerkraut is a dry ferment?

Chef Cynthia: Because you’ve got to rub the salt into the actual cabbage. And then, you’ve got to push it down and make sure that water comes in. So then, you’ve got to make sure you plug it in properly and it can be easy, but it also can be challenging because people sometimes don’t plug it in properly and then it starts to breed bacteria. [Okay, yeah.] And so for wet ferment, [like pickles]. Yeah. Pickles. 

Hayley: I have Hungarian pickles. 

Chef Cynthia: Totally, baby cucumbers in the jar, a couple of Bay leaves, salty solution, cover it and they’re not going to pop up because you’re all in.

Hayley: Yeah, exactly. Awesome. That’s so amazing. Yeah, pickles. That’s I think because I grew up with my mom who’s Hungarian and the idea of a salad was cut up tomatoes and a pickle. [Oh nice.] Yeah. [Beautiful.] That’s awesome. Alright. For some people who may have had ferments, because some ferments have that life, that bubbliness, that vibrancy, maybe some people get gas from a fermentation. What do you say about those people who would love to get some kind of oneness with some ferments? What do you suggest that could potentially be having or is there something else they could try? 

Chef Cynthia: First of all, fermentation is a way to digest food so much easier than it’s not fermented. [Fascinating.] Just put that into context first. So why is someone getting bloated or why is someone getting gassy? Well, their internal ecosystem microbiome is not at the peak of the game. [Okay.] Remember,  when we go to soil to plant something, we’re looking for optimal flavor and we’re looking for diversity and we’re looking for yield and we’re looking for this whole thing, right? We’re soil. We are soil internally. So we’ve got to go there first before we brine the ferment. [Right.] Because that’s what we do. You put there some food. You don’t understand. Cabbage makes me feel like that. The brassica family, you don’t understand what I eat ferments I’m fasting. So, the reason why people get gassy and have this really extreme reaction to ferments and get bloated or smell or whatever it might be, it’s not the ferment. It’s never the ferment because that’s easily digestible when we ferment something. It’s the human internal ecosystem that we must look at. And that’s what we do. We point the finger at food. And you go, you don’t understand. I don’t like that. You don’t understand. I don’t like that. But really, we’ve got to go back to the internal. So, what do we do then? Do we go on Google and try to find how we get healthy? It’s not about you being unhealthy. It’s about deeply understanding the ecosystem body. You  might’ve been contaminated with processed type food substances. It’s our environment, the way we think. It’s the laundry we do with contamination of chemicals in our clothes. It’s not just food. [Yeah.] It’s never just food. And so, we can sit there for a minute and acknowledge that. I think from there, you can start to go within and sow the soil.

Hayley: See that that’s a message from nature. Something’s happening. I’m getting a reaction. Maybe it’s an opportunity to go, okay, there’s something out of balance in my microbiome. How can I bring something in? It’s an indicator. Something you were talking about before about some people, I’m a little off topic here. For some people, beans make me gassy and they used to make me gassy until I learnt to soak them, until I learned to cook them fully. Now, I can enjoy the most amazing beans. I liked my Mexican stuff. And now, it’s just nourishing. There’s no gas. 

Chef Cynthia: So, you think about that. You’ve taken a dry bean legume pulse, whatever you want to call it. You’ve soaked it. You’ve activated back into life, right? Fermentation is the same thing. [Yes.] Beans don’t rot down and die. They create a life. And that life is so fascinating in the internal microbiome of our gut. It’s so fascinating. It’s like bread. We looked at bread in such a devastating and dogmatic way. Oh, I can’t eat that. It’s gluten. Oh, I can’t eat bread. You don’t understand how I feel. It’s not the f***ng bread. We are designed as human beings and we’ve done this very cleverly and accidentally. It’s where somewhere in a kingdom somewhere in a faraway land, somebody was making bread and left a bit of that uncooked dough out and it started to bubble and grow and the next day. It has really become active. So, there’s yeast in the air. We’re into just this raw dough and started to bubble. And then, that servant or whoever it was came in. It’s a classic story around fermentation. I love this. He came in and saw that and it was like, huh, that’s weird. And tasted it. That was borderline kind of because fermentation goes into alcohol, right? That’s funky, but oh I’m just going to bake it anyway. And from that moment in time when they were baking, when they fermented that bread, they felt different like you digest the protein, which is called gluten. Because how we digest gluten is we ferment the actual grain, which becomes milled into flour and then becomes a dough and we ferment it after 36 hours. We are easy to digest it and that’s to me is f***ng magnificent. [That’s amazing.] It’s amazing. So, we point the finger at the grain. You don’t understand. It makes me really bloated. It makes my tummy hurt. Those beans, you don’t understand it. it’s not the food. It’s never the food unless you have an anaphylactic response to an ingredient. It’s really never the food. It’s the internal ecosystem. 

Hayley: It really is something that you’ve just said has really triggered a mind-blowing effect inside. [I saw that.] There were the eyes opening. There’s life and death. We see this as yin and yang. We see this as a cycle. But actually, what I talk about quite a lot is life begets life. Life creates life. And so, it’s not the end of life. It is the creation of another life. It’s not coming back and dying and that. It’s actually creating. It’s always moving forward. And I always talk about how nature grows in a natural succession. It’s always growing abundant. We leave nature alone and it grows abundant. So when something’s dying, there’s this, it’s hard for me to articulate it. And what you’re saying is it’s life inside these microbes. These are more life is around death than death.

Chef Cynthia: Totally. A hundred percent. That’s what my son said. I want to be buried because I’ve meant back into life. It’s a brilliant statement.

Hayley: Absolutely amazing. So, we’ve talked about microbe. We’ve talked about ferments. We’ve talked about biodiversity. There’s so many options you can do here and you can build your microbiome. But what about this is life inside us? How do we feed our microbiome?

Chef Cynthia: Through our thoughts. [Yeah?] Well, there’s many ways. There’s our environment. There’s how we think, how we breathe, how we move. Breath is a big part of the digestive system. Massive. If we can simply, like I said before, leave food be for a minute, allow it to sit there. We’re part of it. We’re part of nature. It’s all encompassing energy. But really our thoughts, it’s the first top of the line of my recipes. It’s everything. It’s any recipe I’ve ever written. If you haven’t looked at any of my recipes, you always see a tag down the end, call it a hashtag, call it what you will write. It is flashing into the energy of the end result. And I remember doing this with my coach like 10 years ago. I started to understand this energy because I would talk about it anyway and I had to articulate it in my recipes. And so, when you’re reading a recipe and you’re interested in looking after your microbiome and you’re interested in making the recipe because it’s going to support your microbiome because all natural real food has enzymes and bacteria on there anyway. Even if you cook them, you still have them on your hand and in your fingers. It’s all there. And so, where thoughts go, energy flows. So for me, the first point of the microbes in the gut is the way I think. And I’m an absolute hundred percent proven for myself going through my own personal trauma and I’ve watched myself just, I’ve watched some serious stuff happen in my gut. I stopped doing it. I was backed up. I started to get a bit of a rash. And I was in my thoughts of negativity and worry and loss and lack of hope. Whatever it might have been, the point is that it wouldn’t matter how much fermented foods I ate. I was up here, negative man.

Hayley: I was just watching an amazing teaching session. You were teaching some of the amazing Heal Thyself coaches. And you said, ‘consciousness creates worlds.’ [Yes.] This is a world. Soil is the world. Plant’s world. There’s science showing that if you have conversations with plants, they respond. [Totally.] Knowing that, how do you cook or create your ferments? Would you put a lot of love in your ferment in a little room just there? With the ginger beer, you put so much love. So, what do you do with your thoughts that help create these worlds?

Chef Cynthia:  I’m inquisitive in the first place so my thoughts aren’t in a response of I don’t know if I can do that. I’m simply inquisitive. I’m so intrigued so that brings so much joy and fun to the art of fermentation. Because I’m really not interested in the end result, health wise. I’m interested in the process. By the time I get to the end result, I’m in all matters of f***ng love affair with that flavor. But I’m not interested in the end result of a ferment because it never is the same. That’s another thing. This ginger beer will not be the same the next time I do it. And so in my life, I really do always sit in the end result of my existence. I really, really do. But with the fermentation, it is the opposite. It is the absolute opposite. It is the process of watching this breakdown within my own conscious participation of that inquisitiveness. It’s f***ng fascinating. [It is.] It is so fascinating to be around all of my other ferments, but it’s so fascinating too. Like my kefir is in the fridge. You said to me, you’ve got kefir? I said, yeah, but I can’t. It’s a baby. If I put it here and then go out for the day and then not come back that night and then come back the next day, it’s gone. I’ve turned it into a complete and on a different vibration. [Yeah.] So I’ve got to be around the kefir to grow it towards it’s a beauty. And I’ve got to actually be in one with my  state of being. It’s all consciousness. Not one is more conscious than the other. We’re only ever, for me,  not conscious if we did. And that’s what my son said to me is that when I die, I want to be buried. So I confirm it because that creates life because death is always on the other end. There’s a consciousness. So we’re never unconscious unless we stop breathing, but it’s another life, right? [Exactly.] It’s the same with the ferment. 

Hayley: And that is all life. It is absolutely fascinating. Cynthia, you inspire me. You really do. I think that’s one of the reasons why you’re so popular, why people are just getting your online courses and just thriving because it’s not just about the food. It’s about nourishing your organs. It’s about nourishing your mind, your body, your soul. It’s absolutely awesome. And so what’s really exciting at this point in time is you have a new online course coming out. [I do.] Tell everyone about it. 

Chef Cynthia: It actually inspired me to make another one straight away. I was like, I don’t want to talk about that one. I’d just go to the next one. It’s such an interesting space actually, because when I create courses, the energy to them is always about how the person can receive it and how they can actually do it at home. And so fermentation has been one of the big things that people have asked me to teach them. And I haven’t wanted to be honest, because it’s never the same. You can’t take your sourdough starter to another city and expect it to be the same bread as mine and yours. It doesn’t work that way. [That’s awesome.] Yeah, I just never felt comfortable doing that because it would be like an attack like, oh, why did the coconut yogurt didn’t turn out like yours? And so I’ve decided to add some fermentation, basic fermentation, a simple fermentation into this course. So, one at home can simply do a dry fermentation and a wet fermentation. And for one at home to understand how their energy response internally in the environment in the ferment matters. And they matter and the ferments matter. So the course is really quite spectacular. And the fact that there’s a part where there’s the six recipes in there that really cover that basic fermentation or the art of fermentation in a very basic, skillful way. It’s very exciting.

Hayley: That’s just one part of this online course. 

Chef Cynthia: Yeah. And the rest is just easy dishes that we can throw together.

Hayley: It’s light and easy to nourish its organs. It’s the whole thing. And anyone that’s listening who knows Chef Cynthia and has her courses, it’s so simple. You’re so much fun in the kitchen. There’s just joy. I see so many people in your Facebook group, watching you in the kitchen and the kids are following as well. You’ve probably got it by now, listening to his podcast or watching it on YouTube, the life, the joy that you bring to all of it. And I just really appreciate you bringing your presence to Thriving with Nature today and sharing the life inside the food and inside you. And it’s just absolutely amazing. I’m very, very grateful. Thank you so much for sharing. [It’s a pleasure.] For those that want the online course, I will be putting a link below and also in the show notes as well if you’re on the podcast. Make sure you hit go and hit that and grab yourself a  copy because they’re absolutely amazing. 

Chef Cynthia: I really love your podcasts because you cover all diversity of different people and it’s not just one subject because it’s all encompassing, right? I might be a chef, but I’m also very intrigued in nature. You have different people come on. It’s really awesome. 

Hayley: Thank you. That’s awesome. I love it. So, thank you so much Thrivers for joining me this week. We’ve got some more exciting guests, more exciting conversations to have about Thriving with Nature. And I’m so blessed that you’ve been here. Have an amazing day. Talk to you soon. 


Hey, if you enjoyed listening to my podcast, remember to subscribe to hear more. You also have to come check out the Thriving with Nature website where all of my videos, podcasts, and resources are to take what we discuss here to the next level and apply it in real life. I’d love to have you come join myself and many others striving towards living a regenerative lifestyle. Go to thrivingwithnature.com.


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